not in Primary anymore

Comment (non)Policy

When I first created this blog, I posted an adopted framework for a comment policy that outlined appropriate, respectful, non-calling-faith-into-question participation. But as time went on and I did see people calling others’ faith into question and being jerkbags, I found myself wanting to leave their comments standing, to enshrine them as examples of why we need this space for discourse. So I deleted the page explaining the comment policy that I didn’t actually enforce.

It has recently come to my attention that it’d be a good idea to clarify what the comment policy or lack of policy is here, and it is this: say whatever you want, but:

1. Don’t assume that you can actually know the motivations or personal decisions of the author on whose post you are commenting.

2. Don’t assume that because no one else has said something in the comments, or because no one corrects your comment, that no one agrees with you or that everyone agrees with you.

3. If you hate what you read here, why are you here? If you love what you read here, we have far more robust discussions in our facebook group. You’re welcome to comment here, but if you enjoy this blog then you might enjoy that group as well.

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19 Responses to “Comment (non)Policy”

  1. Jane

    Spot on! I never could have stayed in the church if I would have had to conform to X Y & Z. Thankfully I’ve found A B & C and feel valued for it. Thank you so much!

    Reply
    • Andrew Lacayo

      The problem with feminists is they don’t just want equality, they want superiority to men. They do the same thing that has been done to them for thousands of years. The problem with mormon feminists specifically is they don’t understand the doctrine of the church. Men are not the priesthood, we bear the priesthood, just like women bear children. Do you hear men complaining to God that they don’t have the ability to be co-creators with Him like women do? Then you say what women wants the pain? Well I say what man wants the stress of leading hundreds of people and being responsible for their salvation? Another thing, both women and men receive the same authority and power of the priesthood through ordinances. And women operate under the same priesthood authority in their callings as men do. Women are given priesthood authority and power, they just are not ordained to bear the priesthood. So what is there to complain about. Feminist mormons don’t understand the doctrine of their own church and need to read Elder Oaks’ talk he just gave on the priesthood in the priesthood session of this most recent general conference. One day feminists will realize how petty and short sighted their views were and their pride will be debased not only before God but before their own divine spirit selves-mark my words.

      Reply
      • Miriam

        “So what is there to complain about.”

        Spoken like a man. News flash—-Mormon feminists =/= pro-woman ordination.

      • Anonymous

        This is perfect! I agree whole-heartedly!

      • Jaxon

        Shhh… you’re giving Mormons a bad identity with your blanket statements and claims of superior knowledge of Doctrine. Do us all a favor and go back to the basics of “love one another”.

      • HeatherB

        I know many, many feminists. A few of them are men haters, but for the most part they are simply looking for the same treatment men get. I remember a number of years ago when the US was doing the whole ERA thing, Canada was as well. We had a meeting called to get us to write to our MP and ask that the ERA clause be taken out of our new constitution. They gave us a little blue book that had a list of things that church lawyers thought would happen if the ERA was passed. I read it and laughed, I couldn’t see how these things could be, or if some of them did happen how it would be bad. Two things specifically, rape would become a thing of the past because we’d all be gender neutral. Hasn’t happened at all. The other thing talked about how men might get more costody of children after divorce. I did see this as a bad thing, what Canada now sees is a lot of joint costody. And since children need fathers as well as mothers I don’t see this as a bad thing. I don’t think women should be ordained, but I do wonder why things changed so suddenly, women used to lay on hands and bless people. I have has many Bishops and Branch Presidents in my life, most have been wonderful, kind men. I have had a few who were sexist. I’m lucky, I was able to ignore the sexist ones and be my self. I have also known a great many LDS men who were sexist as well. Feminism isn’t about being better than men it’s about being treated the same as men. Getting the same pay, the same opportunities for education, for work and health care. I’m lucky, I live in a country where a lot of these things are becoming more equal. I feel sorry for my sisters who live in the U S because all I see is more and more inequality. The church ought tobe a place where every one gets the same treatment, where you feel safe, and at peace. Unfortunately for many people, men and women it is not. I think I’ve lost my point here some where. I have no doubt I’ll figure it out later.

      • HeatherB

        Also I think this is in the wrong place.

      • Anonymous

        I think women …if they desire should start their own churches…invent and build new products…be general contractors…be CEOs…business owners…build roads…no one is stopping them…go ahead…who is going to be the mothers?…raise and nurture children…dumb men? Not very likely…as a man I know and accept my role…its not more important than anyone else’s role…just different…being a man is hard work…not glorified privilege

  2. Carolyn Gibb

    I’m not so young. I’m 66 and have struggled as long as I can remember to feel like I fit in in the church because I see things differently. Emma Lou Thayne, Hugh B. Brown, Lowell Benion, and Eugene England were beacons of light and comfort when I was young and raising a family in a very conservative ward. I thought I was inured to the pain, but your article touched me. Thank you.

    Reply
  3. Brian Hales

    A well written and thoughtful analysis of my son’s coming out video and interview. The one thing that is missing is the eternal perspective provided by LDS theology. It teaches we lived as spirits with gender for millions of years before we came here, but without a physical body (i.e. no sexuality). We are born on earth for a few decades and experience physicality and numerous mortal challenges. Some bodies come with same-gender-attraction, but that does not alter our actual identity which was developed according to our given genders in the premortal world. Here we must control the hormonal drives because our spirits are designed to be exalted as our Heavenly Parents are now. Those who live worthily can become as God now is. Gender is only questioned on this earth. Before and after mortality, our true identities will prevail. And in comparison to eternity, earth life is a blink of the eye.

    I don’t expect you to embrace this theology, but I believe my son does and it brings him peace and generates patience and hope. I am very proud of him and his faith.

    Thanks for listening.

    Brian Hales

    Reply
    • Andrew Lacayo

      We did have gender in the pre-mortal world i.e. sexuality, our gender is eternal just like the Proclamation to the Family states. Our bodies allow us to express the sexuality of our spirits. If our spirits had no sexuality, what would our bodies be expressing? Our bodies have no life in and of themselves. Our spirits give our bodies life, hence the body is a temple. The body is good. Carnally minded people struggle with the temptations Satan gives them to misuse their bodies, and Satan has tried to lie to us for millennia that the body is inherently evil. The doctrine of the church is that the body is a temple and is good-Moses 2:31. You don’t understand the doctrine. To all who struggle with same gender attraction, it is only a sin if you succumb to it, hate the sin and not the sinner. Stop letting the world label you as anything but a child of God, you’re not homosexual, you are a son or a daughter of God who struggles with a temptation, just like we all do in one way or another. Stop letting Satan put labels on you which cripple you into thinking you can’t change. Just like a person with any temptation is heard saying “that’s just the way God made me”-straight out of the mouth of Satan, anything truly bad did NOT come from God. Stop listening to the father of all lies.

      Reply
  4. Alexis Kaiku-Malphrus

    It appears OW leader, Kate Kelly, may be leaving the Church. Just thought you guys should know.

    Reply
  5. Brenda

    I too was worried when this declaration by the church was posted. But as I listened to further explanation I realized that first, if a child was currently a member of the church they could continue to be a member. Second any child can go to primary, young women’s , young men’s and any of the Church’s meetings. Third I have to tell you a story. When I was a teenager there was a friend of mine who wanted to join the church. Her parents however lived different principles in their home and forbid her to join. My friend asked her other friend’s dad to go over there and connive her parents to let her join the church. After talking to the girls parents about her daughter wanting to be baptized, my friends dad who was the bishop said. It is important to honor your parents. When you get 18 you can have the opportunity of joining the church. This was sad for her but she realized the importance of honoring her parents. When children live in a situation contrary to church doctrine such as gay or lesbian couples they are exposed to different principles than what the church teaches. One of my sons friends father died. After he died the mother took on a lesbian partner. The daughter however knew this was against the teaching sf the gospel. She was attending seminary and going to church. She also was preparing to go on a L.D.S. mission. The conflict in there home became unbearable as the daughter tried to live her beliefs when the parents had other standards, or beliefs. It got so bad the daughter almost had to leave the home. This is what the church is trying to avoid by having children baptized before they are 18. They think the family is so important that they don’t want to cause conflict or rivalry in the home. However they are all welcome in the LDS church and can attend any meetings. Those that are members when there parents take on same sex marriage are still allowed to participate and be members. The same goes for other religious parties in which it would be difficult to be a member. To reiterate they want peace maintained in the family.

    Reply
  6. You are so annoying

    ” If you hate what you read here, why are you here?” I feel like I would like to turn this phrase right back around to you. If you hate the mormon church so much, which I’m assuming you do with all of your aggressive posts on facebook and this blog, then why are you here?

    Reply

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